IN CONVERSATION WITH SANA JAVERI KADRI

Sana Javeri Kadri, founder of spice company Disapora Co, ON starting up in business and going with the flow. Interview by Serafina Logiacco for issue 7 of the Sunday Paper.

I first discovered the cult-worthy spice brand, Diaspora Co. through millennial kitchen icon-of-our time, Alison Roman, who casually mentioned their Aranya Pepper was the only black pepper to use. High praise! After sharing a conversation with the founder, Sana Javeri Kadri, a Mumbai native and Oakland dweller, I learned her meticulous quest for the highest quality single-origin spices is no mean feat. Although Sana is three years into her entrepreneurial journey, the continuous navigation of uncharted waters flows strongly. We chatted a few days after she hopped onto one of the last flights from India to the States amidst the COVID-19 chaos. If there's ever been a good time for a lesson in "going with the flow", this seems to be it.

What was your driving force to start Diaspora Co.?

As a senior in college, I took an art history course with a teacher named Phyllis Jackson who was terrifying yet incredible. Phyllis really charged us with ‘what work are you going to do? What is your cultural work?’. When I mentioned to her that I wanted to work in the food industry, she kept pushing, ‘who are you going to be in service for? What systems of oppression are you going to dismantle?’ And what that very painful journey led to was realizing one of the systems of oppression that has really impacted India is colonialism. Colonialism built the foundations of the spice trade, so how do we reconstruct it to put every person involved in power? That idea that I was dismantling something that was connected to my ancestors, to the history of my country, that’s the deep cultural work that has kept me going. Feeling like I was tied to a purpose much greater than my 22-year-old brain could otherwise occupy. 

What amazing thoughts to have at 22!

It’s all Phyllis Jackson. We are all often led by really smart black women.

What are some of the early challenges that you came across starting Diaspora Co?

As a young Indian girl, you’re not taken seriously. The export and spice industries are all led by men. Initially getting people to talk to me was so hard - I didn’t get any response for four months. Finally, I jumped on a flight and showed up to farms unannounced. The big lesson I learned is that business relationships in India are done in person and over a long period of time. Initially, that felt like such a hindrance but now three years in, it’s what sets us apart. We do this deep sourcing, cultivate relationships and nobody can compete because we have done it low and slow. That’s the magic of India - you have to show up and put in your time to win trust, no matter how long that takes. 

Can you tell us more about what separates your sourcing from the typical spice brands out there?

Most spice companies buy from an auction house or importer. The conventional spice trade has ten different steps - farmer to trader, trader to bigger city trader, trader to big auction house, auction house to exporter. This means, when you’re buying tumeric from them - it could be from three different continents, ten different harvests, and maybe fifty different farmers. Spice companies are blending products from fifty different farms and the spices can be anywhere from five to seven years old and still be on the grocery store shelves - which means they are dust by that point. You have no idea of the true origin as they’ve all been mixed together and graded based on size and color. It has nothing to do with flavour or variety. It’s like calling all tomatoes, from heirloom to cherry, just red tomatoes. The industrial system and colonialism flattened the differences. It was about profit off a product without any real care for what it tasted like and who was growing it. 

At Diaspora, we are purchasing from one farmer, one seed variety, and one harvest. It’s always the same-year harvest that we are selling. It’s an unparalleled transparency and quality for the spice industry. We basically created a supply chain from scratch. And in terms of finding our partner farmers, it’s a lot of snooping. The sourcing part takes months. 

What are your leading values and standards when seeking farms?

The hospitality industry is known to hire people whose values align and who believe in what you're doing. That definitely applies here. I mostly meet farmers who are value-aligned. Of course, their product has to be really tasty and committed to high quality, 100% pesticide-free, and committed to beyond organic practices.

Some farmers are pesticide-free but they’re doing it because they hear you can make more money that way - it’s not tied to their inherent value system. I won’t buy from them, because I know if they’re in a pinch they will cut corners and that’s not a risk I could take. The people we work with are actually preaching the gospel of natural and organic farming in their communities - they’re the rebels and outliers. Every farmer that I’ve worked with has had the experience of his village calling him crazy for farming the way he does - but they’ve persevered. 

How do you personally deal with pivoting a plan or changing direction - surrendering to the unknown?

I honestly deal with it terribly and with therapy every week. My anxiety and depression have really skyrocketed since becoming a business owner. It has been some of the most fulfilling work of my life but it’s also been some of the hardest. I’m lucky I’ve had a family and a partner who will be there for me when I need it. But it’s not easy, I think America right now with coronavirus is going through a reckoning with capitalism as we know it. It’s no longer valid. And that’s terrifying but I’m also realising that it will allow a gentler version to come out of this, that will take care of us more. Because business ownership and entrepreneurship as I’ve known it for these past few years is not gentle and does not take care of you. 

Do you have any personal practices for when you’re feeling anxious or overwhelmed that have become helpful for you?

I journal and make lists. I find writing it down makes it so much easier to handle. Often our minds are not able to hold the burden of our thoughts and I find that when I write my thoughts down and organize them on paper, it’s an unloading that's really helpful. Also taking breaks and regulating my work hours - taking lunch breaks has been really important. Sure there’s 1% of the population for whom that’s awesome and they get to call themselves hustlers on their Instagram, but for people like me, that means the next day I’m wrecked and won’t feel good or motivated to work - even though I love what I do and feel a lot of joy from it. 

Has there been anything that surprised you the most since starting Diaspora?

I left India when I was 16 and came out as queer when I was 21. I started the business a year after that and moved back to Mumbai at 22 with no job prospects, no savings, and freshly graduated - it wasn’t the greatest of looks. What surprised me most, is that the business had given me the reconnection to India and had grounded me with the community in India. It allowed me to travel all over the country and visit small villages that I would have never otherwise visited. It solidified the fact that I belonged with these people at a time when I felt pretty alienated and ostracized. I felt that coming out as queer was something that was going to cancel me as an Indian and distance me from my own culture. So the business came as a gift - like ‘no, you can actually be queer and still dedicated and championing for the seeds of where you come from.’ I feel more Indian than ever before and tapped into the heart because I'm tapped into small Indian organic farmers. 

That’s beautiful. Do you find that being a woman influences the way you run your business as well? 

All of the farmers that I’ve worked with have commented that somehow I’ve made them think differently about equity and what that means. I think my lens as a woman in the workplace has really shaped the way that I wanted to run this business and with a model of equity first. To make sure everyone across the supply chain is getting paid which is also something that I find men are, for several reasons, not as sensitive to. I think that vulnerability and compassion that we have as women has definitely influenced how I do business. 

It’s nice to have that holistic perspective from women. Has there been a moment that has stood out to you, to trust in the flow of the universe?

Ha! I think that’s every part of my supply chain. Farmers who can’t read or write in rural India have to somehow get their product to the port of Mumbai, leave it to sail across the ocean to me in Oakland, then it needs to pass through customs - my entire supply chain is a prayer! All the while, nobody is willing to give me information along the way. This is a big lesson in going with the flow! Putting hundreds of thousands of dollars on the sea, and letting it float towards you, it’s nerve-wracking. There’s no other way to deal with it, than to block it out. 

Lastly, do you have a favorite way to use Diaspora spices?

I love to make khichdi which is lentils and rice cooked together with spices - ginger and a bit of onion. It’s just very comforting. Also all forms of rice. Toasting a little bit of turmeric, chillies, black pepper, cumin, in some ghee and pouring it over hot rice and lentils, there’s truly nothing more delicious.